3 drownings today alone....wtf?

[crafters_corner]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/1273886...ge-caution

And, too many murders recently.

What is happening in this country right now?

Are people 'covid tired' ??

[king1]

'tis Christmas - all forms of stress and spending money you don't have...

[Oh_hunnihunni]

Swimming is becoming a rare skill, it isn't taught in many schools because of the cost of pools and their maintenance, and private classes are for the wealthier families. Immigrants rarely have the training, and young people truly believe the sea is a safe playground.

And so more drown every year.

[crafters_corner]

This is a country that is small and surrounded completely by the coast. Water water everywhere. I think that it is easy to become complacent, and I think maybe covid has something to do with it.
Didn't the crime rates go up, after the Christchurch earthquakes?

When we are put under stressful situations, as we have all be under, then anything can and will happen, if we are not being vigilant, and keeping ourselves safe.

Mental stress....the killer that can't be seen, but can pack a punch, when push comes to shove.

Maybe I'm wrong, it happens.

[king1]

This could explain the rise in violence
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/crime/auck...LD4HL2YM4/

[crafters_corner]

"The truth is these violent thugs and criminals don't care two hoots about the community, they don't care about culture or tikanga, they care solely about establishing their criminal enterprise".

Says it all really.

[Lilith7]

Agreed; the Australian govt has a great deal to answer for; they're effectively pissing all over the spirit of ANZAC. Oddly enough a friend & I were discussing this the other day.

They uproot people from what's often the only life they've ever known, & if they try to appeal then they can be stuck in 'detention camps' for months which aren't always near their families.
So some are cut off from families if the distance is too great for visits.

These are Australian made criminals who have little or nothing in common with NZ, & includes people who went to Oz at a very early age & who have no family or any kind of support here.
Its an appalling way to treat people who've already paid the penalty for their crimes.

Returning the 501's helps no one, & I suspect that there may soon be a thriving industry in returning people to Oz, with new identities - if that isn't already happening.

[crafters_corner]

I am sure that I heard, that we (NZ) have more drownings this summer period, than Australia does.

It seems that, at the moment, there's drownings every day.

These have to all be down to human error, surely. So, are people just taking more risks?

I still believe that it is down to the tiredness of lockdowns, the stress of them, and people never being able to relax, and now suddenly, we have all this freedom, and we are a water loving country, with all costs within cooee of each other.

On the news the other night, the CEO of Water Safety NZ, said that if we are going into the water, we need to learn to be able to float, and for a period of time, if we get into trouble in the water. I imagine that is easier to say than do, but being prepared in this way, could surely have saved some of these people.

It is just an ongoing daily tragedy, that should not be happening.

[Lilith7]

Apparently the reason kids are no longer taught to swim at school is that schools can't afford pools & their upkeep. Perhaps we need to look at schools being able to have time for kids to go to a public pool & be taught to swim & perhaps the govt could pay for that.

The cost would surely be a hell of a lot less than death by drowning.

[nzoomed]

Happens every year.
They never taught any of us to swim properly at our school. Just expected that the kids could all do it!

[king1]

Apparently the reason kids are no longer taught to swim at school is that schools can't afford pools & their upkeep. Perhaps we need to look at schools being able to have time for kids to go to a public pool & be taught to swim & perhaps the govt could pay for that.

The cost would surely be a hell of a lot less than death by drowning.

iirc it happened when OSH requirements required all commercial pools to have much more frequent testing, like several times a day or some such. Which I guess imposed more costs on schools, and required someone to be there everyday, during holidays etc  Maybe they also needed to be qualified to take the samples, idk.

[Lilith7]

It would be quite a cost for schools if they were all required to have a pool, qualified instructor & all equipment needed.
Perhaps they could be allowed to use public pools at set times, tuition paid by our taxes if needed.

[Oh_hunnihunni]

We were formally taught, and encouraged to do medals in Life Saving. But that was back when education included things like cooking, sex education, and self discipline. As well as Latin, social studies, geography, biology, chemistry, Maths, French, German, and other boring stuff...

[Lilith7]

We were formally taught, and encouraged to do medals in Life Saving. But that was back when education included things like cooking, sex education, and self discipline. As well as Latin, social studies, geography, biology, chemistry, Maths, French, German, and other boring stuff...

Not so sure on the Latin, but most of that should be being taught to every last one of the kids in the school system.

[sarahk]

They uproot people from what's often the only life they've ever known, & if they try to appeal then they can be stuck in 'detention camps' for months which aren't always near their families.

I don't like it either but most of these 501s have chosen not to get dual citizenship. If Australia really was their "home" they'd have made sure they have the paperwork in order.

When you turn up in a country you have to live by their rules and behave in a way that protects your right to be there. It may mean that you have fewer rights than citizens but you keep your head down until it's official. There will be millions of immigrants in Australia doing just that. If a small number can't toe the line then that's a choice they've made. Every parent should have been watching their kids like hawks and getting the paperwork done as soon as the kid was eligible.

[Lilith7]

They uproot people from what's often the only life they've ever known, & if they try to appeal then they can be stuck in 'detention camps' for months which aren't always near their families.

I don't like it either but most of these 501s have chosen not to get dual citizenship. If Australia really was their "home" they'd have made sure they have the paperwork in order.

When you turn up in a country you have to live by their rules and behave in a way that protects your right to be there. It may mean that you have fewer rights than citizens but you keep your head down until it's official. There will be millions of immigrants in Australia doing just that. If a small number can't toe the line then that's a choice they've made. Every parent should have been watching their kids like hawks and getting the paperwork done as soon as the kid was eligible.

Some didn't just decide to move to Oz though; their parents took them there when they were just little kids.  And Australia has made it rather more difficult for Kiwis to get citizenship since about 2017, having gone back on what they'd told John Key they'd be doing; some may have to wait for up to 10 years .

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-ne...ip-changes

I think that the time comes when parents are no longer responsible for their actions of their adult children.

[Oh_hunnihunni]

While I agree to a point, citizenship costs money. And when you have a family, with working parents raising children, with all those other costs including mortgages, finding a chunk of money to pay for citizenship is a challenge. Last time I looked it was around AUD1000 for Mum and Dad with underage kids piggypacking for free - which is at least a benefit NZ doesn't offer to its would be new citizens...

[sarahk]

Some didn't just decide to move to Oz though; their parents took them there when they were just little kids.  And Australia has made it rather more difficult for Kiwis to get citizenship since about 2017, having gone back on what they'd told John Key they'd be doing; some may have to wait for up to 10 years .

Without a doubt, it has become harder to get citizenship but those kids should grow up knowing that they need it and what's expected. Leave the fine print for later but don't let them be surprised by it later on. I'd be prepared to bet $$$ that teens from other countries know exactly what the steps to citizenship are.

There was a recent article in the Herald about one of these guys. First brush with the law at 16. FFS! Then he was surprised that later on the country decided he wasn't a good fit. Nothing in the article about applications for citizenship, he seemed to be happy not to commit fully to the country his parents adopted.

[Lilith7]

Some didn't just decide to move to Oz though; their parents took them there when they were just little kids.  And Australia has made it rather more difficult for Kiwis to get citizenship since about 2017, having gone back on what they'd told John Key they'd be doing; some may have to wait for up to 10 years .

Without a doubt, it has become harder to get citizenship but those kids should grow up knowing that they need it and what's expected. Leave the fine print for later but don't let them be surprised by it later on. I'd be prepared to bet $$$ that teens from other countries know exactly what the steps to citizenship are.

There was a recent article in the Herald about one of these guys. First brush with the law at 16. FFS! Then he was surprised that later on the country decided he wasn't a good fit. Nothing in the article about applications for citizenship, he seemed to be happy not to commit fully to the country his parents adopted.

Not every parent is perfect; some are feckless, & every country has some of those - it isn't confined to Kiwi families living in Oz. 

 I think the way the Australian govt is behaving towards the 501's  is  barbaric. They've deported at least one person who'd not been convicted of any crime


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-ne...ls-in-2009

"Paul has no criminal history but was refused entry to New Zealand because of AFP advice he was a member of the Rebels motorcycle club, immigration and police officers in Auckland told the family.

Australian with no criminal history handcuffed and flown home because federal police intelligence tied him to gang he left seven years earlier after ÔÇÿnightmareÔÇÖ of intimidation"


https://theconversation.com/why-new-zeal...licy-99447

"Typically, people are notified that their visas have been revoked while they are serving a prison term. In some distressing cases, visa-holders have been intercepted┬áafter theyÔÇÖve been released from jail, or even taken from their distraught families in pre-dawn household raids."

https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/12-03-2...ion-policy

"As the number of deportees has mounted, so too has the death toll. In the past three years, at least four New Zealand citizens have died in Australian custody or immediately following deportation, and researchers believe there are almost certainly more." 

[gr8dadof2]

This says it all too....

"They have no or little attachment to New Zealand and many of them, while they may have been born here, have been raised in Australia ÔÇô they are products of the Australian environment ÔÇô and through that environment they have connections, they have links and they have supply chains" Tukaki said