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+--- Thread: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... (/showthread.php?tid=1143)
The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - C_T_Russell - 19-02-2022
Dont take my word for it, Israel has already confirmed it!
Source https://www.ft.com/content/58cfd452-a85e-4235-8849-0f4a3c89ffc8
What is wrong with their statement though, is that its got nothing to do with the "number" of antibodies!
The vaccine is producing antibodies for the alpha variant! How are alpha antibodies going to recognize a newer variant such as omicron?
You can have all the antibodies in your bloodstream as you like, wont make a scrap of difference!
If 4 shots are not effective, then 3 certainly are not...
Time to drop the mandates and get on with life, 95% of the country is jabbed anyway, on top of it omicron is not much worse than the common cold. Just look at all the hospital cases in the ICU vs delta.
Unvaxxed are spreading it equally as much as fully vaxxed, time to move on and get on with life.
By the time the omicron vaccine is available, it would have long mutated into other strains anyway.
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - Oh_hunnihunni - 19-02-2022
No idea and don't care much. I make my own decisions on the matter and have no need to listen to the latest antivax rubbish.
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - king1 - 19-02-2022
well that's one study of 150 people - perhaps we should wait for something a little more concrete.
Might be something in the water at that hospital...
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - Magoo - 19-02-2022
Where to begin?
What a load of horseshit CT.
And yet you show signs of intelligence.
Must have driven your teachers nuts.
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - ObeWan - 19-02-2022
Why dont you send that to Jacinda and Blomfield?
See how you go.
Report back.
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - SueDonim - 19-02-2022
(19-02-2022, 02:13 PM)C_T_Russell Wrote: Dont take my word for it, Israel has already confirmed it!
Source https://www.ft.com/content/58cfd452-a85e-4235-8849-0f4a3c89ffc8
What is wrong with their statement though, is that its got nothing to do with the "number" of antibodies!
The vaccine is producing antibodies for the alpha variant! How are alpha antibodies going to recognize a newer variant such as omicron?
You can have all the antibodies in your bloodstream as you like, wont make a scrap of difference!
If 4 shots are not effective, then 3 certainly are not...
Time to drop the mandates and get on with life, 95% of the country is jabbed anyway, on top of it omicron is not much worse than the common cold. Just look at all the hospital cases in the ICU vs delta.
Unvaxxed are spreading it equally as much as fully vaxxed, time to move on and get on with life.
By the time the omicron vaccine is available, it would have long mutated into other strains anyway.
Sorry - the article is behind a paywall. Not really a source I'd go to for medical information anyway.
"The vaccine is producing antibodies for the alpha variant! How are alpha antibodies going to recognize a newer variant such as omicron?"
That's partly true, but there's more to it. There was a good article in pretty much plain English on Medscape a while ago that explained more about how the immune system works and why the vaccine is still helpful even after the virus has mutated. Sorry, but I can't find the article again. Medscape reports medical advances rather than being it's own source.
Bottom line is that it's clear that the booster shot does make a difference.*
"omicron is not much worse than the common cold"
That's because we are all vaccinated. But also doesn't account for the impact of long covid. People with minimal symptoms can still end up with ongoing issues. It's better to not get sick if possible.
"Unvaxxed are spreading it equally as much as fully vaxxed"
Vaccination does help to reduce the spread. And people also need to remember that poor hand hygiene is also a spreader. You may not have the disease, but all the vaccination in the world doesn't stop you spreading it by touch.
* Some real articles:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41423-022-00837-6
"... the booster vaccines induce more effective immune responses against the omicron spike than two-dose vaccination..."
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(22)00092-7/fulltext
"... the broad neutralising response observed suggests urgent global action to deliver three-dose vaccination might increase population immunity against current VOCs (including omicron) and help prevent the emergence of new variants...."
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2788485
"... receipt of 3 doses of mRNA vaccine, relative to being unvaccinated and to receipt of 2 doses, was associated with protection against both the Omicron and Delta variants, although the higher odds ratios for Omicron suggest less protection for Omicron than for Delta..."
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - king1 - 19-02-2022
here's a link to the article
https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www.ft.com/content/58cfd452-a85e-4235-8849-0f4a3c89ffc8
Same author has his name on this article which advocates the fourth shot
https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www.ft.com/content/8fa9fb5e-8aa8-40c0-a889-99d16e179644
links are funny because I used a paywall bypass
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kkofljmpfaanangehehmbkkmbgjjlgja
RE: The vaccine doesnt work for omicron... - SueDonim - 20-02-2022
(19-02-2022, 06:48 PM)king1 Wrote: here's a link to the article
https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www.ft.com/content/58cfd452-a85e-4235-8849-0f4a3c89ffc8
Same author has his name on this article which advocates the fourth shot
https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www.ft.com/content/8fa9fb5e-8aa8-40c0-a889-99d16e179644
links are funny because I used a paywall bypass
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kkofljmpfaanangehehmbkkmbgjjlgja
Thanks for that. I could see the articles so long as I didn't accept cookies, which is a bit weird.
I tried to find the original research articles that were being reported but failed to identify exactly those ones. The are both related to Sheba Medical Center which seems to be doing a lot of related work though. That trials should contradict each other is part of the overall study process - to look at why the results might be different, check for confounding factors, and do more trials. That a non-medical resource like FT picks up individual studies out of context is part of why laymen get confused.
Paywall bypass services are basically stealing from the copyright holders so I normally wouldn't use them, just in this context I had a look out of curiosity but not again. I would also be careful of downloading anything from them as someone setting up to bypass legitimate publishing income could also be dodgy in other ways. Having said that, this one looks like it's just accessing Google's cached version which is often, but not always, automatically available and also shows how the page has changed (ie been edited) over time. It's not necessarily available for paywalled material though.