Pro vs anti - Printable Version

Pro vs anti - Printable Version

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RE: Pro vs anti - kiwi - 01-12-2021

There are a number of people on social media who promote the idea of a flat Earth and try to prove it using science. Suppose the number of people posting this idea became more than half the world's population. Would you then follow suit? Because that is what you have said.

RE: Pro vs anti - king1 - 01-12-2021

(01-12-2021, 09:29 PM)kiwi Wrote: There are a number of people on social media who promote the idea of a flat Earth and try to prove it using science. Suppose the number of people posting this idea became more than half the world's population. Would you then follow suit? Because that is what you have said.

well that explains why antivaxxer's seem completely bonkers to me, and no doubt┬áthe rest of the population -┬áthe twisted logic┬áof that statement is just fit for purpose...┬á including flat earthers in your defense probably wasn't the best idea...

RE: Pro vs anti - kiwi - 04-12-2021

You said I should just do what everyone else is doing. That is a very bad idea and flawed reasoning.

RE: Pro vs anti - king1 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 04:26 AM)kiwi Wrote: You said I should just do what everyone else is doing. That is a very bad idea and flawed reasoning

The science is very clear about the benefits of vaccine in this case, for yourself and for others - the only reasoning you should be considering is why┬áyou are denying the science?┬á

or┬áfor you,┬áis it more so┬áas you have stated earlier, "I don't like being told what to do", which sadly┬áimho is just an excuse in the middle of a global pandemic...

I don't know, maybe it serves your purpose to divert discussions away from actual facts towards technicalities in discussions...

RE: Pro vs anti - Kay2021 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 07:46 AM)king1 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 04:26 AM)kiwi Wrote: You said I should just do what everyone else is doing. That is a very bad idea and flawed reasoning
The science is very clear about the benefits of vaccine in this case, for yourself and for others - the only reasoning you should be considering is why┬áyou are denying the science?┬á

or┬áfor you,┬áis it more so┬áas you have stated earlier, "I don't like being told what to do", which sadly┬áimho is just an excuse in the middle of a global pandemic...

I don't know, maybe it serves your purpose to divert discussions away from actual facts towards technicalities in discussions...┬á Do you still not consider yourself an antivaxxer?

Looks like Omicron is changing the landscape.┬á Seems to be irrelevant whether you are vaccinated or not.┬á Cases so far considered to be mild.┬á In 30 countries now.┬á No deaths.┬á Could change, see what happens in future.┬á Cases are doubling or near doubling daily in South Africa.

RE: Pro vs anti - Oh_hunnihunni - 04-12-2021

No one really likes being told what to do, especially if it is by people they don't like or respect. But the reality is we face a pandemic situation that poses a serious existential threat to large numbers of people and organisations. In such rare situations individuals have to reassess their personal response and consider the wider ramifications. This isn't an everyday scenario where our choice really has no impact on the wider community. Each choice comes with real consequences beyond ourselves, real consequences for family, for friends and for complete strangers. Minimising those consequences is why we closed borders, went into lockdowns, spent vast amounts of public money on vaccines and publicity campaigns, ramped up the health system, and seriously limited personal freedoms.

It is a war situation. Nothing less. We didn't ask for it, and there is absolutely nothing the individual can do to stop it. In such situations the pragmatic choice is to unite, rather than go against the mainstream.

RE: Pro vs anti - king1 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 08:04 AM)Kay2021 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 07:46 AM)king1 Wrote: The science is very clear about the benefits of vaccine in this case, for yourself and for others - the only reasoning you should be considering is why┬áyou are denying the science?┬á

or┬áfor you,┬áis it more so┬áas you have stated earlier, "I don't like being told what to do", which sadly┬áimho is just an excuse in the middle of a global pandemic...

I don't know, maybe it serves your purpose to divert discussions away from actual facts towards technicalities in discussions...┬á Do you still not consider yourself an antivaxxer?
Looks like Omicron is changing the landscape.┬á Seems to be irrelevant whether you are vaccinated or not.┬á Cases so far considered to be mild.┬á In 30 countries now.┬á No deaths.┬á Could change, see what happens in future.┬á Cases are doubling or near doubling daily in South Africa.

There is an awful lot of Delta out there still -┬áand what comes after Omicron?┬á
I had you┬ápegged from the first post didn't I?┬á┬á Smile

RE: Pro vs anti - Praktica - 04-12-2021

We spend our whole lives doing what other people want - do you drive? Observe speed limits? Which side of the road do you drive on? Did you go to school? Who chose what you would learn? Do you bank, or shop? Queue at the checkout? We all have rules which we internalised when we were children. To object now that "somone wants me to be vaccinated - I don't want to because I'm free" is childish and foolish.

RE: Pro vs anti - Olive - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 09:04 AM)Praktica Wrote: We spend our whole lives doing what other people want - do you drive? Observe speed limits? Which side of the road do you drive on? Did you go to school? Who chose what you would learn? Do you bank, or shop? Queue at the checkout? We all have rules which we internalised when we were children. To object now that "somone wants me to be vaccinated - I don't want to because I'm free" is childish and foolish.

I agree. ┬áWell said.

RE: Pro vs anti - Oh_hunnihunni - 04-12-2021

It is the price I think, for membership of a community. If we are happy to accept the benefits, then it seems only fair we pay the price without too much whinging. You are right, only children do not understand that everything comes at a price.

RE: Pro vs anti - Kay2021 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 08:58 AM)king1 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 08:04 AM)Kay2021 Wrote: Looks like Omicron is changing the landscape.┬á Seems to be irrelevant whether you are vaccinated or not.┬á Cases so far considered to be mild.┬á In 30 countries now.┬á No deaths.┬á Could change, see what happens in future.┬á Cases are doubling or near doubling daily in South Africa.
There is an awful lot of Delta out there still -┬áand what comes after Omicron?┬á
I had you┬ápegged from the first post didn't I?┬á┬á

There is a lot of Delta, at the rate Omicron is expanding in South Africa I doubt that will last, if it continues that way, its unknown.┬á As far as we know it is not here in New Zealand yet, so not making the comments with New Zealand in mind.┬á ┬áIf you insist on pegging people then you will always be attaching to the same line.┬á Since Dec 5 I have been watching this virus, and I continue to do so.┬á Hang me, if you must, use those strong┬ágrip pegs though the others tend to snap in the gales. Smile

RE: Pro vs anti - king1 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 10:12 AM)Kay2021 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 08:58 AM)king1 Wrote: There is an awful lot of Delta out there still -┬áand what comes after Omicron?┬á
I had you┬ápegged from the first post didn't I?┬á┬á
There is a lot of Delta, at the rate Omicron is expanding in South Africa I doubt that will last, if it continues that way, its unknown.┬á As far as we know it is not here in New Zealand yet, so not making the comments with New Zealand in mind.┬á ┬áIf you insist on pegging people then you will always be attaching to the same line.┬á Since Dec 5 I have been watching this virus, and I continue to do so.┬á Hang me, if you must, use those strong┬ágrip pegs though the others tend to snap in the gales.

keep it factual, no misinformation and we will be fine

RE: Pro vs anti - Kay2021 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 11:44 AM)king1 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 10:12 AM)Kay2021 Wrote: There is a lot of Delta, at the rate Omicron is expanding in South Africa I doubt that will last, if it continues that way, its unknown.┬á As far as we know it is not here in New Zealand yet, so not making the comments with New Zealand in mind.┬á ┬áIf you insist on pegging people then you will always be attaching to the same line.┬á Since Dec 5 I have been watching this virus, and I continue to do so.┬á Hang me, if you must, use those strong┬ágrip pegs though the others tend to snap in the gales.
keep it factual, no misinformation and we will be fine

??┬á What does that mean? ┬áI have not posted misinformation here or anywhere.┬á Since 24 Nov when Omicron was announced in SA the new daily cases have gone from 1,275 to 16,055 today, thats in 9 days.┬á Check for yourself.

RE: Pro vs anti - king1 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 12:23 PM)Kay2021 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 11:44 AM)king1 Wrote: keep it factual, no misinformation and we will be fine
??┬á What does that mean? ┬áI have not posted misinformation here or anywhere.┬á Since 24 Nov when Omicron was announced in SA the new daily cases have gone from 1,275 to 16,055 today, thats in 9 days.┬á Check for yourself.

You mentioned something about┬ávaccines being irrelevant?┬á If that is not misinformation, I would love to know┬áyour reasoning...

RE: Pro vs anti - Kay2021 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 12:38 PM)king1 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 12:23 PM)Kay2021 Wrote: ??┬á What does that mean? ┬áI have not posted misinformation here or anywhere.┬á Since 24 Nov when Omicron was announced in SA the new daily cases have gone from 1,275 to 16,055 today, thats in 9 days.┬á Check for yourself.
You mentioned something about┬ávaccines being irrelevant?┬á If that is not misinformation, I would love to know┬áyour reasoning...

This is what I wrote:┬á "┬áLooks like Omicron is changing the landscape.┬á Seems to be irrelevant whether you are vaccinated or not. "┬á ┬áUnvaccinated, vaccinated┬áand previously infected with covid┬áare being infected with Omicron.┬á Cases reported to be mild.┬á I also said that could change, its unknown.

RE: Pro vs anti - Lilith7 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 09:37 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: It is the price I think, for membership of a community. If we are happy to accept the benefits, then it seems only fair we pay the price without too much whinging. You are right, only children do not understand that everything comes at a price.

I think those opposed would benefit from learning a bit about Polio & TB, & the havoc which both diseases wrought until brought under control by vaccination. Rolleyes

RE: Pro vs anti - Kay2021 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 01:59 PM)Lilith7 Wrote:
(04-12-2021, 09:37 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: It is the price I think, for membership of a community. If we are happy to accept the benefits, then it seems only fair we pay the price without too much whinging. You are right, only children do not understand that everything comes at a price.
I think those opposed would benefit from learning a bit about Polio & TB, & the havoc which both diseases wrought until brought under control by vaccination.

Had the polio vaccine, was immune to TB so didn't need it.┬á One each way there.┬á Walking through the middle.

RE: Pro vs anti - Oh_hunnihunni - 04-12-2021

Immunity changes as we age. It's part of the process. Fortunately TB it seems affects a certain socio economic group far more readily than the rest of us white middle class whoopsies, so with luck that immunity will last.

Nasty disease TB. But I believe covid kills quicker.

RE: Pro vs anti - Praktica - 04-12-2021

TB can affect anybody, and until the 1950s there was no reliable treatment. Even now, antibiotic resistance makes it difficult to treat. In my research into my ancestors and relations, I found a surprising number who died of TB. I can remember having Heaf tests, BCG vaccine, and chest xrays, checking for TB.

RE: Pro vs anti - Lilith7 - 04-12-2021

(04-12-2021, 03:15 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: Immunity changes as we age. It's part of the process. Fortunately TB it seems affects a certain socio economic group far more readily than the rest of us white middle class whoopsies, so with luck that immunity will last.

Nasty disease TB. But I believe covid kills quicker.

┬áIndeed - very common for quite a while, until they got it sorted - Katherine Mansfield died of it quite young I think. And they didn't realise that it was infectious for some years either.

I was reading a bit about Somerset Maugham, whose mother died when he was about three┬áearlier today - she died of it & had been told by a Dr that childbirth was an excellent cure.
Bizarre, the ideas which once held sway.